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Broko

Problems With The Hunter

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Of course you don't HUNT the HUNTER. How does that even make sense in your mind? I guess you also think it's ok for a pack of gazelles to hunt and kill a lion.

 

You see devs? You see what kind of mindset you encourage by giving survivors every possible way to avoid death?

 

I don't know how strong the night hunter was at first to warrant making him what he is now but you've completely flipped the game mode on it's head as evidenced by the people who think it's ok to rush into the face of danger and hunt the night hunter. And they're mostly right because survivors have everything necessary to be a hunter. If you're going to give them this power then at least make it like evolve where going in by yourself is suicide.

 

If the Hunter was the only one that can do the hunting then how would you ever be able to call BTZ balanced? The developers made Humans and Hunters to play two different ways, they can play defensively or offensively. Being able to hunt the opponent is normal for balanced (or want to be balanced) games.

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If the Hunter was the only one that can do the hunting then how would you ever be able to call BTZ balanced?

 

Because you don't have to kill the night hunter to win? He's there to stand in the way of your goal which is to destroy the nests. You seem to keep forgetting that.

 

 

The developers made Humans and Hunters to play two different ways, they can play defensively or offensively. Being able to hunt the opponent is normal for balanced (or want to be balanced) games.

 

Playing offensively does not mean you are hunting. Hunting implies that you are facing something much weaker than yourself that poses little threat to you, making it easy prey. You can fight and survive against the night hunter (possibly killing one for making poor choices against you) but by no means should you be able to hunt the hunter.

Edited by jcks

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Because you don't have to kill the night hunter to win? He's there to stand in the way of your goal which is to destroy the nests. You seem to keep forgetting that.

 

 

Playing offensively does not mean you are hunting. Hunting implies that you are facing something much weaker than yourself that poses little threat to you, making it easy prey. You can fight and survive against the night hunter (possibly killing one for making poor choices against you) but by no means should you be able to hunt the hunter.

 

The objective is also to win right? Not dying helps the Humans win and killing the Hunter buys the Humans time. You seem to not understand that this game mode is played in multiple ways.

 

Like I said the Hunter can do the same as well. Isn't that's why he's called the Night Hunter? The Hunter was meant to be hunted because he is an opponent and also for balancing reasons. This game is meant to be balanced, so if a Hunter can hunt Humans then that means the Hunter can be hunted. If a Human has to run away from a Hunter because of his aggression then it should be the same against the Hunter.

Edited by Broko

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The objective is also to win right? Not dying helps the Humans win and killing the Hunter buys the Humans time. You seem to not understand that this game mode is played in multiple ways.

 

Like I said the Hunter can do the same as well. Isn't that's why he's called the Night Hunter? The Hunter was meant to be hunted because he is an opponent and also for balancing reasons. This game is meant to be balanced, so if a Hunter can hunt Humans then that means the Hunter can be hunted. If a Human has to run away from a Hunter because of his aggression then it should be the same against the Hunter.

 

 

The objective is to destroy all five nests. You win by destroying nests. They say this before every single match. 

 

The objective of the night hunter is to kill the survivors 10 times so obviously he needs to be able to hunt. The reason the night hunter can be killed is so that survivors have a chance to complete their objective without being murdered every time he's near (and he moves fast). They need to be able to fight back and defend themselves. This does not mean they can turn the tables and go hunt the night hunter whenever they want. You as a SURVIVOR should not be trying to actively hunt the night hunter at all to save time. You supposed to SURVIVE and destroy the nest before you are wiped out.

 

There are times when you should fight and times you should run. That's what it means to be hunted. Knowing the difference is crucial to playing as a night hunter. As a survivor you never have to run, you can always be on the offense. It should be the other way around.

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The objective is to destroy all five nests. You win by destroying nests. They say this before every single match. 

 

The objective of the night hunter is to kill the survivors 10 times so obviously he needs to be able to hunt. The reason the night hunter can be killed is so that survivors have a chance to complete their objective without being murdered every time he's near (and he moves fast). They need to be able to fight back and defend themselves. This does not mean they can turn the tables and go hunt the night hunter whenever they want. You as a SURVIVOR should not be trying to actively hunt the night hunter at all to save time. You supposed to SURVIVE and destroy the nest before you are wiped out.

 

There are times when you should fight and times you should run. That's what it means to be hunted. Knowing the difference is crucial to playing as a night hunter. As a survivor you never have to run, you can always be on the offense. It should be the other way around.

 

The Hunter won't be able to wipe you out if you're Hunting it, and Humans won't be able to destroy hives while being hunted. Sounds fair to me.

 

I don't think you understand how a balanced game is supposed to work.

Edited by Broko

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The Hunter won't be able to wipe you out if you're Hunting it, and Humans won't be able to destroy hives while being hunted. Sounds fair to me.

 

I don't think you understand how a balanced game is supposed to work.

 

So you admit that survivors overpower the hunter when they decide to fight back? ("The Hunter won't be able to wipe you out if you're Hunting it")

 

And did you forget that this mode allows 4v1? Two survivors can keep the night hunter busy. The other two can destroy the nests. So yes survivors CAN destroy the nest while the night hunter is being hunted. Still sound fair to you?

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The Hunter won't be able to wipe you out if you're Hunting it, and Humans won't be able to destroy hives while being hunted. Sounds fair to me.

 

I don't think you understand how a balanced game is supposed to work.

Actually... It looks like you're the one who doesn't know how balanced games are supposed to work.

When I play the hunter, it's annoying.  To do well means you fought noobs.  Nothing fun about that.

When I am the survivor and the zombie enters.  It's SO easy.  No stress for me whatsoever.

I just spam survivor sense, walk backwards facing him to the nests.  Since there's like 0 zombies this works 100% of the time.

Then when he gets close I spam my UV light in his direction.  He will always run away or into it.  With no chance of him getting close.

If he throws spit or tries to I just spam dodge to whatever direction.  When it misses I dodge again because it won't explode in time.

If he gets a pounce by SOME form of miracle, I will just toss a UV flare as soon as I hear the testicles.  And if I can't throw in time I simply press my UV light and it counters it.  (I never get pounced so this is literally just 2 backup plans).

3 melee's from my machete and the hunter is toast enough for me to get a nest.  Resulting in 2 zombies which are stronger than the night hunter dying.  Allowing me to stealth.  After stealth it's easy to go right to the next nest or HUNT THE HUNTER HIMSELF WITHOUT BEING ABLE TO BE SEEN IN TIME.

 

If you think survivors are balanced.  You are only proving that you don't want it nerfed due to the fact you know if it does get nerfed.  You'll start to suck.  And you wouldn't want that, would you?

You're the reason great games get ruined.  

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Actually... It looks like you're the one who doesn't know how balanced games are supposed to work.

When I play the hunter, it's annoying.  To do well means you fought noobs.  Nothing fun about that.

When I am the survivor and the zombie enters.  It's SO easy.  No stress for me whatsoever.

I just spam survivor sense, walk backwards facing him to the nests.  Since there's like 0 zombies this works 100% of the time.

Then when he gets close I spam my UV light in his direction.  He will always run away or into it.  With no chance of him getting close.

If he throws spit or tries to I just spam dodge to whatever direction.  When it misses I dodge again because it won't explode in time.

If he gets a pounce by SOME form of miracle, I will just toss a UV flare as soon as I hear the testicles.  And if I can't throw in time I simply press my UV light and it counters it.  (I never get pounced so this is literally just 2 backup plans).

3 melee's from my machete and the hunter is toast enough for me to get a nest.  Resulting in 2 zombies which are stronger than the night hunter dying.  Allowing me to stealth.  After stealth it's easy to go right to the next nest or HUNT THE HUNTER HIMSELF WITHOUT BEING ABLE TO BE SEEN IN TIME.

 

If you think survivors are balanced.  You are only proving that you don't want it nerfed due to the fact you know if it does get nerfed.  You'll start to suck.  And you wouldn't want that, would you?

You're the reason great games get ruined.  

 

I'm talking about in terms of the Multiplayer in this game. I don't care who gets nerfed by the way, just as long as the game gets balanced. I know there's something here that people are not seeing.

 

They're doing something to the game tomorrow so we'll see what happens.

Edited by Broko

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I'm talking about in terms of the Multiplayer in this game. I don't care who gets nerfed by the way, just as long as the game gets balanced. I know there's something here that people are not seeing.

 

They're doing something to the game tomorrow so we'll see what happens.

ever heard of April Fools?

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Disregarding nests to hunt the hunter is not how this game was intended to be played. At least not in my opinion. But that is how the game mode is built right now. A time limit for survivors between nests would help this problem a lot. Or maybe if you hit the time limit more/larger defenses spawn. That way it punishes the survivor for not playing the objective. Lets say a 6 minute time limit. That's a 30 minute game in all. I think that's more than fair. This will also solve camping issues. It may even stop a lot of the dodge spammers considering they would need to actually make a move other than dodging until you fail because the hunter could then just stall you out. This wont solve any issues with the actual combat but I think it would be a healthy change for this game mode.

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Disregarding nests to hunt the hunter is not how this game was intended to be played. At least not in my opinion. But that is how the game mode is built right now. A time limit for survivors between nests would help this problem a lot. Or maybe if you hit the time limit more/larger defenses spawn. That way it punishes the survivor for not playing the objective....

 

Well that misses the point for me when survivors are hard on playing objective... they have easier time winning overall. When they chase, hunter has more time for his skills to recharge and maybe pick fights not in nest zones where death usually means loosing a nest.

Edited by Cypeq

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def yes yes yes agreed appon this is the mindset of every survivor thats decent hunt the hunter down kill him then take one nest n repeat devs have destroyed this game mod already but that evlve style would be awsome just one OP as chupacabra hunter with these humans that work in fours to try to kill you

I don't know by you guys are going on and about how the night hunger shouldn't be hunted which is stupid. if you guys are complaining about this it just goes to show your not all that good at playing the hunter ,but sure some issues need to be fixed on both side so instead of being biased look at both sides. Ever heard the phrase "HUNTER HAS BECOME THE HUNTED" it happens it basically a natrual instinct for every animal it's KILL OR BE KILLED.

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I don't know by you guys are going on and about how the night hunger shouldn't be hunted which is stupid. if you guys are complaining about this it just goes to show your not all that good at playing the hunter ,but sure some issues need to be fixed on both side so instead of being biased look at both sides. Ever heard the phrase "HUNTER HAS BECOME THE HUNTED" it happens it basically a natrual instinct for every animal it's KILL OR BE KILLED.

 

There is no looking at both sides. The night hunter lost all his exploits while survivors have gained new ones. There is nothing else you can take from the night hunter that isn't a part of his intended playstyle. He has no issues.

 

And also nest mode =/= deathmatch. One way to win is killing the defender but that's not the main objective and it certainly shouldn't be as easy as it is here.

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Again it's how you play I honestly just think your bad at being the hunter I absoultely have no problem when I play as the hunter but as I said before there are things that need to be fixed for both sides and if you disagree then that's just you being biased I play as the survivor and the hunter so I can see they both have issues.

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Again it's how you play I honestly just think your bad at being the hunter I absoultely have no problem when I play as the hunter but as I said before there are things that need to be fixed for both sides and if you disagree then that's just you being biased I play as the survivor and the hunter so I can see they both have issues

you've obviously never fought a competent survivor.  Oops I mean hunter*.  The current hunter should be named survivor.  When I fight a hunter.  ANY hunter.  It's easymode.  No worries all game. Oh look, you're a moving mark on my map.

Uv light your direction. Not in sight?  Oh well, you'll get bored eventually and come after me.

My UV light has basically infinite charge ;).  

If you lose as the survivor, you should stop playing the game, or look up a tutorial on how to spam UV flares/light.  Because survivors right now are WAY better than the "hunter".

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Again it's how you play I honestly just think your bad at being the hunter I absoultely have no problem when I play as the hunter but as I said before there are things that need to be fixed for both sides and if you disagree then that's just you being biased I play as the survivor and the hunter so I can see they both have issues.

 

And why would you think I'm bad at being the hunter? Because I'm pointing out all the exploits and inherent flaws with survivors?

 

And you keep saying the night hunter has issues but I have yet to see you mention anything about him that needs to be nerfed.

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Maybe Techland could Introduce Limited Recharge Cycles for the UV Lamp. And have UV Lamps restock after a Nest Batch is Destroyed.

 

This would encourage the Humans to focus more on the Objective. And Discourage them from Hunting the Night Hunter.

 

That would ruin the multiplayer for the Human faction all together. Like I said before, there are two ways to play in BTZ mode if you're a Hunter or Human. You can play offensively or defensively, and there are many ways the counter both play styles for the Hunter or Humans.

 

If your idea were added to the game it would completely destroy the offensive tactics for the Human. It wouldn't be fair if a Hunter can be offensive and a Human can't. Taking away the Human's only ability to defend themselves from the pounce should never be an option for any reason.

 

I don't mind changes to the Hunter or Human, but that will definitely ruin the multiplayer.

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I agree if that what chaos deception said as added the humans would have no means of offense and on the other hand the hunters can abuse that rule and keep swooping in on the humans and force them to use their uv Rays and as we all know it doesn't matter how many times the hunter dies hes not limited to a number of lives like a survivor.

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Maybe Techland could Introduce Limited Recharge Cycles for the UV Lamp. And have UV Lamps restock after a Nest Batch is Destroyed.

 

This would encourage the Humans to focus more on the Objective. And Discourage them from Hunting the Night Hunter.

 

 

That would ruin the multiplayer for the Human faction all together. Like I said before, there are two ways to play in BTZ mode if you're a Hunter or Human. You can play offensively or defensively, and there are many ways the counter both play styles for the Hunter or Humans.

 

If your idea were added to the game it would completely destroy the offensive tactics for the Human. It wouldn't be fair if a Hunter can be offensive and a Human can't. Taking away the Human's only ability to defend themselves from the pounce should never be an option for any reason.

 

I don't mind changes to the Hunter or Human, but that will definitely ruin the multiplayer.

Actually, if I can chime in, I don't think Chaos has a bad idea there at all.

 

As the game is now, a Human who isn't actively going for the nests is either acting as a distraction for fellow Humans or not playing the game correctly, and in neither situation should confrontations last very long. Tying in UV Light usage (with that usage # resetting upon death and Nest destruction) points Humans in the right direction and would make for much shorter, less troll-ridden games.

 

The numbers don't have to be anything small - just enough to keep people from thinking, "I can just play around. I don't need to go for the Nests."

 

As it is now, there's simply zero punishment for abusing the UV Light to the point of depletion. That "wild abandon" playstyle would change if it only returned after death/Nest kills. And, honestly, if the UV Light is actually depleted, the Human's doing something wrong. There's no reason to slam down on the button for that long except the mindset of "Why not? It'll come right back." It's no better than, "Why not use 200+ flares? I have 800,000," and that was dealt with in a smart manner.

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Broko as it stands, the Humans are on the Offensive too often. In part due to having No Urgency Imposed on them to Destroy the Nests (Eg: A Time Limit)

 

Personally I beleive this is an Aspect of the Gameplay that would Benifit from such Changes.

 

Ideas and Inspiration Speak Volumes and get Results. Without Ideas from the Comunity we would not have had the changes and Updates that have been made to Dying Light and BTZ.

 

Please don't be so quick to dismiss My Ideas. As can You really say for sure whether it would work or not when it has not been Tested.

 

The same can be said for other Users Ideas posted thoughout the Forums.

Edited by Chaos_Deception

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There are latency problem with the hunter and the survivors I will give you that, but those are glitches. The survivors have dropkick (unavoidable) the hunter has tackle (avoidable). The survivors have DFA (unavoidable) the zombie has pounce (avoidable). The zombie has UV spits (avoidable through dodging and negated by flares). The zombie has ground pound (which has no effect on a player who is about to drop kick you) The survivors have melee that can kill in two or less hits (Latency can allow the survivors to kill the hunter even after they have been blown away by ground pound). The zombie has horde spits (which is the most effective weapon in the hunters arsenal) the survivors have 4 vs 1 in which the can easily revive their partners. The survivors have 10 lives the hunter has 5 nest location (because the survivors can wipe a nest just in the time take to respawn the hunter a death to the hunter mean losing a nest).  The hunter can only rely on the techniques displayed in the video. I might mention that all the glitches that were shown in the video require the hunter being able to hit very small window of opportunity. Some major balancing is needed. 

 

I have been on both sides of the invasions. I can honestly say it takes waaaaay more skill to be the hunter than it is to be the survivors.

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