jande135

To All Those Complaining About Underpowered Zombie

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You have to use your brain to win as the zombie.  I have plenty of videos of me absolutely clowning flare spammers, drop kickers, safe zone campers, and air drop dupers on my xbl profile.  Once you understand all the tools at your disposal, you're advantages far exceed those of the humans.  There is so much nuance in this mode when you effectively use all the tools available not to mention all the options within the environment to do away with the humans (spike traps, explosive barrels, falls).  

I agree with some of the patches that have been discussed, but it's frustrating to see so many people complaining about humans having an "unfair" advantage. 

Your mind is your greatest advantage as the zombie.  Goodnight, good luck.

 

P.S. This game does Evolve better than Evolve.

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It's not impossible to win as a night hunter but to say the night hunter has advantages that "far exceed those of humans" is plain ignorance. I could provide plenty of videos where survivors have a clear advantage.

 

Using your wits is fine and all but don't mistake that as being balanced, you're just the better player in those cases.

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I just got done playing 2 humans who were duplicating air drop crates into a room to barricade the entrances and then proceeded to air strike the perimeter.

They got me a few times until I worked out a strategy of uv spitting inside a window, running towards the door and ground pounding whoever tried to dodge, and then pouncing one through a very narrow space in the crates. I allowed one human to live inside as he would be trapped for the rest of the game.

Then it was as simple as cherry picking the remaining survivor each time he spawned.

 

This is one of the cheapest crews I have faced yet, and I was still able to win.

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Again that's not balanced, that's you exploiting an opening in their strategy and outplaying them. I have plenty of games where I've won in difficult conditions but that didn't stop me from seeing the major balancing issues in favor of humans.

 

Number one example - EXPCalibur. That sword does not belong in this game mode.

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Again that's not balanced, that's you exploiting an opening in their strategy and outplaying them. I have plenty of games where I've won in difficult conditions but that didn't stop me from seeing the major balancing issues in favor of humans.

 

Number one example - EXPCalibur. That sword does not belong in this game mode.

Interesting fact about the EXPcalibur - it actually has a "damage type" that is completely unique to the weapon, which is why it was causing bugged-out OHKO damage.

 

I haven't seen one in a while - dunno if it's still active on consoles, but I'm sure the increased damage mitigation will help once the patch goes live, regardless.

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Let Me break this down for all to see.

 

 

Picture the Scene. 4 Players all of which constantly ping Survivor Sense.  And are travelling in a Staggered Formation that is far enough apart to avoid Spit Splash.

 

But close enough to cover each other with UV Light. should the Hunter get lucky with a UV Spit or Horde Spit.

 

One Human focuses on the Nests while the other 3 keep a Staggered Formation close by.

 

 

When ever the Hunter attempts to close in for a Kill. the Hunter gets Tagged by UV and is Drained. and if crippled is Killed.

 

Played this way, it is pretty much Impossible to win. No Matter your Skill Level.

 

  • UV Light has too much range, and recharges very fast.
  • Survivor Sense can be spammed once every Second.
  • Night Hunter needs a Damage Output Bonus that Increases when against more Humans.
Edited by Chaos_Deception

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Interesting fact about the EXPcalibur - it actually has a "damage type" that is completely unique to the weapon, which is why it was causing bugged-out OHKO damage.

 

I haven't seen one in a while - dunno if it's still active on consoles, but I'm sure the increased damage mitigation will help once the patch goes live, regardless.

I figured it was something like that. A weapon with 321 damage having OHK capabilities that a katana with 2000+ damage doesn't makes no sense.

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I wouldn't say people using cheated Air Drops are good players. I can imagine killing those pretty easily, because they have to focus on spamming and usually do so when they don't know the correct strategy to win.

 

Also you don't need Survivor Sense at all. You just need to listen to growls, tendrils, jumps and screams. That coupled with Hunter health showing whenever you point in the right direction and BAM - you shoot UV in his face a mile away making him easily visible. Once you locate him he can't do anything without getting his face melted with UV. Disabling SS would work only if Human was forced to be distracted by hordes of zombies - you can't keep track of Hunter's location in that moment. But there are no zombies so...

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I figured it was something like that. A weapon with 321 damage having OHK capabilities that a katana with 2000+ damage doesn't makes no sense.

Btw...the original EXPCalibur(that is yellow in the inventory) is a normal one xD the one that is OHK is the one that the player make with the blueprint(grey in the inventory)

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Let Me break this down for all to see.

 

 

Picture the Scene. 4 Players all of which constantly ping Survivor Sense.  And are travelling in a Staggered Formation that is far enough apart to avoid Spit Splash.

 

But close enough to cover each other with UV Light. should the Hunter get lucky with a UV Spit or Horde Spit.

 

One Human focuses on the Nests while the other 3 keep a Staggered Formation close by.

 

 

When ever the Hunter attempts to close in for a Kill. the Hunter gets Tagged by UV and is Drained. and if crippled is Killed.

 

Played this way, it is pretty much Impossible to win. No Matter your Skill Level.

 

  • UV Light has too much range, and recharges very fast.
  • Survivor Sense can be spammed once every Second.
  • Night Hunter needs a Damage Output Bonus that Increases when against more Humans.

 

+

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Let me clarify that I am by no means saying the game is balanced. I just want to express how wrong people are when they complain about the zombie being underpowered. Once you unlock all the hunter abilities, you have plenty of options for success. It comes down to outsmarting your opponents with keen situational awareness and quick decision making.

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...but he IS underpowered. The fact that you need a fully upgraded Hunter to even stand a chance is a testament to that. These complaints aren't unwarranted.

 

The survivors need to have way less of an advantage so you as the Hunter don't have to put in an absurd amount of effort just to get one kill.

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<p>

 

Let Me break this down for all to see.

 

 

Picture the Scene. 4 Players all of which constantly ping Survivor Sense. And are travelling in a Staggered Formation that is far enough apart to avoid Spit Splash.

 

But close enough to cover each other with UV Light. should the Hunter get lucky with a UV Spit or Horde Spit.

 

One Human focuses on the Nests while the other 3 keep a Staggered Formation close by.

 

 

When ever the Hunter attempts to close in for a Kill. the Hunter gets Tagged by UV and is Drained. and if crippled is Killed.

 

Played this way, it is pretty much Impossible to win. No Matter your Skill Level.

 

  • UV Light has too much range, and recharges very fast.
  • Survivor Sense can be spammed once every Second.
  • Night Hunter needs a Damage Output Bonus that Increases when against more Humans.

You're forgetting the hunter's UV Block and the fact that the hunter ground pound can be used when crippled. If the hunters close in and attack, you can ground pound (or Spit Slam), UV Block, and go to town on them.

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Also you don't need Survivor Sense at all. You just need to listen to growls, tendrils, jumps and screams. That coupled with Hunter health showing whenever you point in the right direction and BAM - you shoot UV in his face a mile away making him easily visible. Once you locate him he can't do anything without getting his face melted with UV. Disabling SS would work only if Human was forced to be distracted by hordes of zombies - you can't keep track of Hunter's location in that moment. But there are no zombies so...

 

I don't agree with that at all.  Without Survivor Sense, the humans become almost worthless, especially when playing alone.  I don't think Survivor Sense as it stands today is game breaking, but I do understand complaints about it.  I saw someone post a solution to this by suggesting a cool down on the ping.  I wouldn't be opposed to that. 

 

 

You can use your brain to chomp on less experienced survivors all day but the second you run into a human who also understands strategy its game over.

I've played plenty of skilled survivors and still come out on top.  One thing I haven't been able to spend much time on is groups of humans.  Very rarely do I find a game of 3 or 4 survivors.  The majority of my games are played against solo players and some couples sprinkled in here and there.

However when I do play against the 3 and 4 packs, I find that they are much better players in general and I have much more fun trying to figure out how to divide the group. 

 

 

...but he IS underpowered. The fact that you need a fully upgraded Hunter to even stand a chance is a testament to that. These complaints aren't unwarranted.

 

The survivors need to have way less of an advantage so you as the Hunter don't have to put in an absurd amount of effort just to get one kill.

Underpowered is the wrong word.  If you're directing this at low level hunters, then yes of course they're underpowered due to the fact that they have less skills, but I had no trouble filling out my skill tree as a hunter.  

I think the effort you have to put in to get a kill makes it all the more fun and rewarding.  

 

Look guys, I'm all for tweaking the game here and there, but the complaints of underpowered hunters just aren't correct.  If you want to make an argument to maybe limit the number of total flares a human has per game, okay I get that.  

One thing I am 100% on board with is to increase the hits that nests take to kill.  I think the damage to nests should be strictly hit based and not based on damage output.  Someone earlier said that the hunter basically has 5 lives, as death ensures the destruction of one nest.  That person is absolutely right.

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I have seen Matches played without using Survivor Sense.

 

 

A Twitch Streamer "Huntman98" Played a 1 VS 1 Match with the above conditions as a Human, at My request.

 

"Huntman98" succeeded although He did Die a few times, He caught out the Night Hunter many times because:

 

* Loud Footsteps

* Heavy Breathing

* Tendril Sounds

* Banging when landing on Metal Roofs.

 

 

The need for Survivor Sense is lessened when more Players are in the Game.

Because You can all be watching different Directions as You move from Nest to Nest.

 

 

And I can verify that this also works in 2 vs 1 Games as Me and My Cousin "sty3ler06" have tried this.  And its actually pretty fun and more challenging.

Edited by Chaos_Deception

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1. i win the majority of my matches as either hunter or every match as my survivor(i only let low level hunters win to get exp to help them level a  little) and i know the zombie is underpowered 

 

2. the zombie should be a master of fear and stealth instead it is often hunted to the point of being put onto the  extinction list

 

3. the devs who watch matchs have seen how the humans have the uperhand against 80-90% of hunters and are making some changes to aid the hunters (aka balancing) 

 

4.humans have have 6 ohk attacks while the hunter has 3 2 of which is easier to avoid then 4 of the humans 

 

5. the humans can pop a night hunter booster and will never die from hand to hand combat with the hunter

 

i could keep going but just cause your 1 of a few highly skilled nh doesnt mean that the average or even skilled hunters stand a chance against 1 survivor nevermind 4 

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Humans have Eyes and Ears for a Reason.

 

I wish more emphasis was focused on the Senses rather than Survivor Sense giving away the Night Hunters Location 24/7. 

 

 

That Gives Me an Idea.

 

 

Imagine if Survivor Sense was removed and the Humans had to rely on Line of Sight.

 

And the Night Hunter could only Detect Humans when in Close Proximity to the Humans.

The Humans can cancel the Night Hunters Detection by breaking Line Of Sight.

The Night Hunters UV Spit can be seen even when Line of Sight is Broken.

 

This would give the many Structures and Intricate Layout of Harran so much more Function, and would add an Element of Stealth to Be The Zombie.

Edited by Chaos_Deception

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I am a rank 2 zombie...Guess how I got to rank 2? The guy was not at his PC.. I cant for the life of me kill anyone. Everyone I play kills me in one freaking hit. The UV lamp is kryptonite x 10, It reaches too far. Everyone knows where I am at all times so I have no chance of surprise attacks. I am very good with hook/tentacle movement "I played Q2 Lithium for years and the grapple hook was the main way to get around, mid air battles were common" so I know how to get around the map with out touching the ground so its not me not knowing how to move, its like second nature. I have zero abilities and its frustrating as kurczak! I don't want to give my opinion just yet on balance since I do not have all the skills unlocked for the zombie. But its looking like the humans are overpowered.. I just got done playing against 3 other humans and never got one kill, not even close. They spammed flares and spammed their lamps in my direction. I wanted to disconnect so bad but I stayed and watched from a distance... This mode has a lot of potential but it needs work fast if Techland wants people to play it. Seems like its already dying which is really sad.

 

EDIT: Just won 2 in a row. After I unlocked a couple skills things got way better. I even beat 4 guys at the same time.  I know they weren't bad asses but I will take it. This is why I didn't want to judge things just yet. I will keep trying to get better.

Edited by SoloCreep

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Humans have Eyes and Ears for a Reason.

 

I wish more emphasis was focused on the Senses rather than Survivor Sense giving away the Night Hunters Location 24/7. 

 

 

That Gives Me an Idea.

if thats the case i hope that means they gotta search for nests as well

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@jande135

Where can I watch your matches? Can you upload to YT?

I can PM you my gamertag.  All my videos are on my activity feed on XBL.

 

I am a rank 2 zombie...Guess how I got to rank 2? The guy was not at his PC.. I cant for the life of me kill anyone. Everyone I play kills me in one freaking hit. The UV lamp is kryptonite x 10, It reaches too far. Everyone knows where I am at all times so I have no chance of surprise attacks. I am very good with hook/tentacle movement "I played Q2 Lithium for years and the grapple hook was the main way to get around, mid air battles were common" so I know how to get around the map with out touching the ground so its not me not knowing how to move, its like second nature. I have zero abilities and its frustrating as kurczak! I don't want to give my opinion just yet on balance since I do not have all the skills unlocked for the zombie. But its looking like the humans are overpowered.. I just got done playing against 3 other humans and never got one kill, not even close. They spammed flares and spammed their lamps in my direction. I wanted to disconnect so bad but I stayed and watched from a distance... This mode has a lot of potential but it needs work fast if Techland wants people to play it. Seems like its already dying which is really sad.

 

EDIT: Just won 2 in a row. After I unlocked a couple skills things got way better. I even beat 4 guys at the same time.  I know they weren't bad asses but I will take it. This is why I didn't want to judge things just yet. I will keep trying to get better.

Exactly.  Once you fill out your toolbox and knowledge of the games mechanics, you really do become a hunter.

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As far as Survivor Sense goes and the people making cases for eliminating it altogether:

 

The hunter's pounce ability is based on contextual activation.  Combine this with the hunters movement speed and tendril locomotion, a human without survivor sense has very little chance of survival.  If the hunter rushes in from long distance, tendrils in from above, and pounces before the hunter can locate the hunter's orientation.  Elimination of Survivor Sense would require a complete overhaul on the game's foundation.  (Plus, all the people currently complaining how difficult it is to kill humans will now be complaining about how difficult it is to spot the hunter before getting murdered.)

 

I'll use Left 4 Dead as an example.  Survivors in L4D do not have any sort of radar.  This is balanced out by brighter environments (you can still see into the distance at night) and effective flashlights.  Neither of these things exist for the humans in Dying Light.  In DL, nighttime is oppressively dark and the flashlight provides vision to things that are more or less in your immediate area.  (A case can be made for using potions...)

The L4D hunter must be exactly that: a hunter.  The hunter must crouch and allow the pounce to charge.  They must also aim their pounce.  There is a margin of error here that is non existent for the hunter in DL.  

 

I do not think you can remove Survivor Sense without removing the hunter's contextual pounce OR making the environments less dark/increase flashlight effectiveness.

Edited by jande135

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