DanTheKraut

Will You Geolock The Row Version For German Steam Users?

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I want to ask if you plan to geolock the ROW version for german Steam Users? I' am asking this because I have read that you plan to release a censored version for Germany (a Zombie game without gore is like pron without sexual content = not worth the time  -- > just my opinion). The other reason is that as a german PC player who is forced to play his bought games most times via Steam I start to feel that I become a second class customer because I'am from Germany and because I play on PC (I own nearly 1000 games on Steam which shows I pay and play).  

 

With a geolock I mean no activation, download or start with a german IP something which is sadly possible with Steam! 

 

Just a few words and thoughts about such a geolock:

  • Geolocks are based on your decision no one forces you to implement one (no one not Steam, not the german laws)! 
  • There is no law which forces you to implement a geolock (there is non this was proven many times before!)!
  • A geolock only affects Steam Users because on PS4 and XBox One there is no possiblity for a geolock.
  • If there would be any law which would force you to do so you would violate it anyway because the law does not make a difference between PC and consoles (again such law doesn't exist).
  • German adults have the right to buy/import indexed (Indexed List A and B ), banned (As example §131 and §86 StGB)  and unrated games (unrated = not USK approved) something you can even read on the USK website also the EU gives us this right to import any game (As a EU citizen I can buy whatever I want within the EU which also includes games)!
  • The only things a geolock does is that it makes cheap versions (russian and asia as example) and illegal copies more attractive. Cheap versions because VPN would be necessary anyway and illegal copies because cracked = no geolock at all. In both cases you would lose money!
  • Pirates don't need to deal with geolocks but customers who are willing to buy the uncensored version would have to circumstance the geolock or becoming pirates.
  • A geolock will definitly end in bad publicty for you and will affect future sales. I don't need to bring examples you only need to google "Sleeping Dogs + Geolock" and read the articles and comments.

Quote from the USK (the german rating board for games) the important stuff is bold:

Who thought of the idea of age rating for computer games?
This was a political decision enshrined within the German Children and Young Persons Protection Act (JuSchG) in 2003 and providing a legal basis for the labelling of games. The consequence is that games may not be sold or supplied to children and young persons or presented on screens. Is this censorship?No, publishers submit their titles voluntarily. There is no reason why a computer game should not appear without a rating symbol. Adults are also free to decide what games they play and have legal access to unrated games and to games which have been placed on the index of media deemed unsuitable for children and young persons. For this reason, there can be no question of censorship in this regard. Censorship is in any case prohibited pursuant to Article 5 of German Basic Law.

http://www.usk.de/en/service/faqs/

 

I can also post quotes from the Bundesprüfstelle (BPjM) and from several court decisions which are stating the same if needed.

 

The best option for you if you really want to release a censored version for Germany --> Don't geolock the uncensored version! 

Even better --> Don't waste money on a censored version there will be enough publicity for your game :)

 

Best regards

A german customer who don't like censored games and geolocks

 

P.s.

A lot of german Steam Users are interested in your hopefully positive answer. I have linked this topic in a Steamgroup called ForUncut! this group has over 80000 members and all of them want their games uncensored ;)

http://steamcommunity.com/groups/foruncut/discussions/0/624074858748502762/

Edited by DanTheKraut

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I know what you mean. Left4dead (best zombie game so far) is the best example. The censored version wwas bullshit. You could only play with a uncensored "hack" but now it doesnt run anymore so it is just a pain in the chupacabra and odnt worth time to play it. Censoring ruins the game. Please dont make this happen. You could cancel the german version instead and only sell the US version. Thats nearly the same then.

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I know what you mean. Left4dead (best zombie game so far) is the best example. The censored version wwas bullshit. You could only play with a uncensored "hack" but now it doesnt run anymore so it is just a pain in the chupacabra and odnt worth time to play it. Censoring ruins the game. Please dont make this happen. You could cancel the german version instead and only sell the US version. Thats nearly the same then.

 

But you can import Left 4 Dead 1 and 2 uncut fine in Germany and also play it without a problem ;) I don't want to mod my games to make them uncut I want to buy them uncut!

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I would like 2 know it too. I preordered this game on Amazon UK since we from germany and EU have the rights to Import games for private use. I don`t like to cancel my Preorder on last day of release just because there is no support for german peoples, thanks to bethesda and steam and the beginning of a chupacabra geolock. Australia has much more censored games then germany but only germany got the geolock, and only because gamedeveloper/publisher dont know anything about german law.

 

Daying Light disaper from german Steam Store and a few Websites are saying the gore Version of Daying Light didnt passed for the USK. PLEASE give us a Statement what will be now with PC Gamers...

 

Please tell us, will you GEOLOCK Dying Light for PC STEAM Users?

 

I know, GEOLOCK is a Steam problem and Consoles can still Import and play without problems, but for the LAW its the same chupacabra. If you add a GEOLOCk to PC then you MUST add it to consoles too!! The law is for all platformes and if you think we need a geolock in germany then law counts for PC and Consoles! Else you act again the law anyway, so don`t hate us PC Gamer and give us the change to Import the game since our LAW don`t say we cant import games for private use (only child chupacabra is prohibit!!)

Edited by Lexia

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Well I see you regionlocked it already for Germany... bad decision because there is no law which forces you to do so (pls don't bring that argument we busted Square Enix and Bethesda already with their lie about mysterious laws which forces them to regionlock their games and we will be happy to do this again which ends in bad publicty) and it WILL only increase piracy! If I can't activate a legally bought copy why should I the game instead of getting a regionlock free copy?  

Edited by DanTheKraut

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Well I see you regionlocked it already for Germany... bad decision because there is no law which forces you to do so (pls don't bring that argument we busted Square Enix and Bethesda already with their lie about mysterious laws which forces them to regionlock their games and we will be happy to do this again which ends in bad publicty) and it WILL only increase piracy! If I can't activate a legally bought copy why should I the game instead of getting a regionlock free copy?  

 

A region lock is not the same as an geolock, you are not alowed to sell this game in germany but as a german you can import the game and activate it like Dead island 1 and Riptide. You don`t need a permanent VPN to play this game like you need if it would have an geolock. There is no reson to pirate the game for now.

 

Regionlock: Cant be purchased in your Country but you can Import it from other Countries in EU, for example UK or AT or CH. (some Games need VPN to activate the game but not to play for example South Park and Saints Row 3)

Geolock: Can only be activated and played outside of Germany (or country witch get geolock), the only way to play a geolocked Game is buying it on Consoles or using on PC permanent VPN with another IP then your Country (witch is agains Steam ToS).

 

pirating a Game with geolock is the best deal peoples can do, I`m not a fan of that and I prefer to boycot the Publisher who use this but also its not only the publisher its a Steam/Valve problem as well. On Consoles you can play games with geolock because you can play them OFFLINE, with Steam you can`t. there is a offline mode but Steam track your IP, you still can`t play this games offline!

 

And again ... I don`t think they will add an geolock now, game is releasing soon and a lot of peoples already bought or got it giftet from friends outsite there owen country, adding now a geolock would be again law, since steam dont take gifts back. You can see all countries who cant purchase it on her owen country here: https://steamdb.info/sub/51297/ (you can also see there is no prohibitrunincountry and no tradingandgifting=no).

Edited by Lexia

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A region lock is not the same as an geolock, you are not alowed to sell this game in germany but as a german you can import the game and activate it like Dead island 1 and Riptide. You don`t need a permanent VPN to play this game like you need if it would have an geolock. There is no reson to pirate the game for now.

 

Regionlock: Cant be purchased in your Country but you can Import it from other Countries in EU, for example UK or AT or CH. (some Games need VPN to activate the game but not to play for example South Park and Saints Row 3)

Geolock: Can only be activated and played outside of Germany (or country witch get geolock), the only way to play a geolocked Game is buying it on Consoles or using on PC permanent VPN with another IP then your Country (witch is agains Steam ToS).

 

pirating a Game with geolock is the best deal peoples can do, I`m not a fan of that and I prefer to boycot the Publisher who use this but also its not only the publisher its a Steam/Valve problem as well. On Consoles you can play games with geolock because you can play them OFFLINE, with Steam you can`t. there is a offline mode but Steam track your IP, you still can`t play this games offline!

 

And again ... I don`t think they will add an geolock now, game is releasing soon and a lot of peoples already bought or got it giftet from friends outsite there owen country, adding now a geolock would be again law, since steam dont take gifts back. You can see all countries who cant purchase it on her owen country here: https://steamdb.info/sub/51297/ (you can also see there is no prohibitrunincountry and no tradingandgifting=no).

 

It is not about needing a VPN to play (not atm) it is about needing a VPN to activate a legally bought copy as the game has already both tags set which require a VPN for the activation if you would read the SteamDB you would see it yourself. Prohibitrunincountries isn't set but that is not what I was talking about.

 

Besides that you do not need to show me what a geolock or regionlock is because if you look at the Steamforums of Wolfenstein, Sleeping Dogs: DE or Dead Rising 3 you will see who started the threads with the same issue there. 

 

I don't care what consoles are able to because I do not own one and won't buy one. 

 

For your sentence about a geolock would be against the law at this time... as somebody who actually studied law I can definitely say this is not the case. 

Edited by DanTheKraut

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Hmm.... Polish Dev team makes a game that isn't available in germany? Historical Karma lololol

That is the most arrogant and stupid post I have read in a forum for quite some time. Which is quite an achievement. :)

 

 

Anyway, I have asked the same question here in the forum and so far no official answer whatsoever. Which really is a shame.

I've tried to point out that in case I pre-order the game and just the DLC will not work, I have lost money and in case the game itself can't be activated, I have lost a lot of money, because no one will refund me. But hey, in that case they already have my money, so who cares? And in case I wait until release and see what happens with the game, I can not benefit from the pre-order bonus.

 

And a technical question. Does "region lock" only mean that I need to import the game or would I have to use a VPN to activate it as well? Because that is something I will just not do. According to Steams terms of use, using a VPN is a reason to get my whole account banned. Which would be quite expensive for me. And even if Valve would not care, I simply refuse to jump through hoops for something that could be easily available.

Edited by The L-Bolt

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That is the most arrogant and stupid post I have read in a forum for quite some time. Which is quite an achievement. :)

 

 

Anyway, I have asked the same question here in the forum and so far no official answer whatsoever. Which really is a shame.

I've tried to point out that in case I pre-order the game and just the DLC will not work, I have lost money and in case the game itself can't be activated, I have lost a lot of money, because no one will refund me. But hey, in that case they already have my money, so who cares? And in case I wait until release and see what happens with the game, I can not benefit from the pre-order bonus.

 

And a technical question. Does "region lock" only mean that I need to import the game or would I have to use a VPN to activate it as well? Because that is something I will just not do. According to Steams terms of use, using a VPN is a reason to get my whole account banned. Which would be quite expensive for me. And even if Valve would not care, I simply refuse to jump through hoops for something that could be easily available.

I was joking bud, learn to laugh and pull that stick out of your arse

You also clearly don't understand the definition of arrogance

Edited by Smokey_Badger

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I was joking bud, learn to laugh and pull that stick out of your arse

You also clearly don't understand the definition of arrogance

Well, that is the problem with sarcasm, all too often it is not recognizable as such in written form. So what you think is humour... might be perceived completely differently by other people. This is why you should think at least for a second about how your words could be perceived.

 

When I was 6 years old, a polish women who was clearly not old enough to have seen the war spit me in the face and called me things I could perfectly understand even when I was only 6 and spoke no word Polish. I am 40 now and I have faced a lot of people like this. People who have never suffered the war, who are not german, who have the luck of not having to live with such a history and therefore believe they are somehow better human beings. And who use remarks just like yours, because it is just such a convenient insult. This is, by the way, what I call arrogance.

 

My apologies for my snarky reaction, I am sorry for that. But I will NOT apologise for not finding your remark especially funny, because it simply was not.

 

 

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Well, that is the problem with sarcasm, all too often it is not recognizable as such in written form. So what you think is humour... might be perceived completely differently by other people. This is why you should think at least for a second about how your words could be perceived.

 

When I was 6 years old, a polish women who was clearly not old enough to have seen the war spit me in the face and called me things I could perfectly understand even when I was only 6 and spoke no word Polish. I am 40 now and I have faced a lot of people like this. People who have never suffered the war, who are not german, who have the luck of not having to live with such a history and therefore believe they are somehow better human beings. And who use remarks just like yours, because it is just such a convenient insult. This is, by the way, what I call arrogance.

 

My apologies for my snarky reaction, I am sorry for that. But I will NOT apologise for not finding your remark especially funny, because it simply was not.

 

 

im sorry for offending, I know you were entirely uninvolved in any of those events. I was merely joking around, whether you found it funny or not, it still, was not technically arrogance, it was offensive humor lol

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Well, if this would be the case, if they know nothing about the game getting region/geolocked or not, they could at least tell us that, don't you think? Apparently this is of concern for us german gamers, we will lose our money in case this gets locked. But not a single word in return.

 

But in case the game is released and gets locked and nobody will refund us... and I would, philosophically speaking, open a thread that says "Dear Techland, I have payed for your game, now would you mind if I pirate it?"... I bet THIS would lead to a reaction. :)

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I doubt the devs have anything to do with the regional availability of their game.....

I doubt that you have read the first post in this thread.... now stick to your WW2 sarcasm.

Edited by DanTheKraut

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It is indeed bad with Games for adults in Germany, i mean even in your 30's you cannot buy a gory game in a Store, the only way is to import it.

But what's actually worse is the delay of the physical version of the game, which forced me to get a digital key somewhere and hope not to get banned for a payed key.

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You will not get banned for activating an digital key, if you buy your key from an unauthorized reseller steam can delete you the game without saying any words but this will not give you a bann. Also key will only be deleted if the key was marked from publisher as stolen like it was with Sniper Elite 3 but thats realy rar.

 

I also think this thread can be closed now.

 

keys are not restricted and dont need VPN to activate, there is also no geolock. Thread should be solved now.

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Thats your owen problem, valve already said that ru games are only for cis countries and they got also trading locked. If you had bought the game on preorder you still could play without vpn and just to let you know, valve only loocked singlecopy not the left copies from 4-pack. Give your "friend" the game back he can get refund after contacting steam. But trading lock is made by valve because of the fallen rubel and your "friend" get an info before he buy the game that he can only gift it in cis/gus countries.

 

Russia is not an eu country, you can import but if it doesnt work you dont get support. Next time spend a little bit more and get the eu edition or waite for a sale if the game is too expensive for you.

Edited by Lexia

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