Chickeninja

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Chickeninja last won the day on February 20

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  1. Chickeninja

    Post Any Btz Bugs/exploits Here

    Yeah, that's why so many of us have been doing this since launch and why its been posted numerous times over the years, right? Wrong. Their status as exploits depends on context: with some players/friends as hunter that have the experience to adapt and reply appropriately, no problem and you're right. Is it knowledge available in hints or accessible to ALL players in game or in public? Can every experienced hunter adapt and reply? Was this use intended by developers and the community at large? I would say the answers here are less clear, which is why other players see that as another exploit and why - for now at least - it should be posted. It's questionable so thanks for sharing. Note that I post today in more spamable short form for everybody here that has difficulty with long or full sentences.
  2. Chickeninja

    Buff Hunter

    @ Vertigo and @ empathicc Firstly, thanks for re-posting, focusing more attention, and taking more seriously what you don't read or take seriously. Replying as you both do, provides more justification as to why Techland doesn't have more open lines of communication in place for the game mode in terms of player feedback. In the context of game feedback forums: trolling, insults, and spamming, whether you approve of them, find them hilarious or not, are merely admissions that folks issuing them have no original thought, reply, or argument on the topic. Like hunters circling the same spots, unable to come up with a reply to some opponent(s) actions, they howl and tendril back-and-forth without a plan. I am not your opponent here though, but hey, if you want to use the forum to keep broadcasting howls without a plan be my guest. It's almost become the rule by now here anyway.
  3. Chickeninja

    Buff Hunter

    Tl dr bold font. The rest is boring context venting I have no time to make more concise. My first impulse to this thread was "they should explain why", but after giving it a second's worth of thought, I laughed at myself. In the spirit of avoiding negativity on this forum I will make some general comments. A certain kind of lack of sportsmanship is making the rounds that is quite amusing. It's an attitude that pretends to value playing the game fairly, immaculately clean vanilla style, while simultaneously holding that the use of certain exploits is now accepted by the wider community. While that fact in itself may not be problematic, within the context of groups that actively hide advanced techniques, tactics, and game experience from each other to advance their number of wins or push the rep of their local group, the attitude of "we're just balancing things ourselves here" masks plain old cheating via informational advantage. The basic foundation of fair, clean games is that all participants have equivalent access to informational resources, particularly those that confer advantages. Now of course the world ain't perfect, and if I invade folks that are cheating and being brazenly toxic about that fact, it would be disingenuous of me to pretend that I have not used such advantages myself in the past. But I'll say one thing: I'm not particularly proud of that behavior. I should abort there every time. In most scenarios however, folks being non toxic with specific questions... I will share everything I know on the spot precisely because not doing so tarnishes my fictional sense of game accomplishment and my sense of sportsmanship. Why I find this amusing? Because many of the same players out there that will have others report-arrest-exposed for running around with glitched weapons or worse, are gladly and happily policing their own advantages, keeping them from others + guess what? Surprise reveal, my friends: they hide/explain away advantages while denouncing the cheaters. Like the wolves complaining that the lions are predators, willing to cheat for any advantage. Lions are just casual trash hackers with holier-than-thou attitudes, right? And Techland shares some responsibility here, even if the phenomenon is common in gaming today. In failing to cultivate a more benevolent, cooperative atmosphere in the community (hey, we all want to enjoy ourselves... so why all the toxicity?) and not engaging/informing players more, such passivity stimulates: - keeping advantages to ourselves to the extent that forums and boards loose their value as resources - the kind of negative playing experience that results from folks not being able to explain to themselves why they lost or how to better their game, - group/player competition becoming more toxic, personal, and abusive in tone and nature, e.g. the amount of folks manipulating more impressionable and/or less experienced players by dangling cheats, skill advantages, membership etc. in front of them as reward for compliance or supposed "lessons". Folks may hold against me what I already argue, that "the game mode is an OP mess anyway, you're still assuming that balance is attainable... what should be done is damage control on OP humans exploiting everything and cheating on professional levels". And even though this view pings "damage control versus professional level cheats", buffing the hunter will indeed bring more satisfaction to high level hunters facing such survivors in the short term but also reinforce the general logic of the trend over time. It will be less kind to intermediate level survivors who will face more OP beginner hunters, not to speak of intermediate hunters that will annihilate said intermediate level survivor given more buffs. Given the state the mode is in now, buffs to abilities or a larger number of them, will increase one thing: the amount of possible glitches and unpredictable behavior of the game. I therefore respectfully beg to differ with some if not all folks in this thread: not really more buffs for now please. I'm not sure anymore, that the state that the game mode has developed into can be balanced in the first place. And while an asymmetrical setup is not impossible to balance in theory, in practice we know that merely buffing/nerfing without precise orientation will merely multiply the chaos. Yes more impressive wins, but at the cost of more absurd losses and randomness. And that is less attractive to me in games because I tend to not favor randomness, super sonic bombers on roofs, autobalance etc. Peace + gg to all.
  4. Chickeninja

    We are back on the 1/12 Update, temporarily.

    I'm sure to check it out when I have a bit more time to play! For now, 1/12 is starting to get dull. For all the understanding that the community keeps bringing up in terms of seeing that not everybody's wish list can be fulfilled: 1/12 is what it is. As a hunter, I am among those that feel forced to offer handicaps. And as survivor it's as ugly as watching bad play be rewarded excessively over and over. Somebody held up a Digital Scapes quote, indicating that the game mode was broken and should be fixed, to which Digital Scapes supposedly replied: "I tried.", implying the impossibility of pleasing everybody. Be that as it may, nobody is asking for the moon here... and if people love 1/12 as an extra Nightmare mode or whatever: I'm cool with leaving the door open for that... And while it may indeed be mathematically impossible to please everybody, in retrospect some updates came a lot closer to the aim of providing enough breadcrumbs for beginners while maintaining a reason for more experienced folk to play. Nobody demands perfection, but imperfection has a wide spectrum: one value that needs a tweak is a whole different ballgame from letting Hunters perform Katy Perry Fireworks with spits without consequences, 8 meter DFAs, HUD sluggishness, Zaid flare mechanism broken etc... for fans of the game mode to be merely standing around waiting for increasingly unskilled hunters to press q. I guess its summer vacation in Poland or something.
  5. Chickeninja

    We are back on the 1/12 Update, temporarily.

    Because the Night Hunter should be feared again? I was in fact joking the other day, but like clockwork... apparently. Good luck to the island endeavors @ Drakorus btw.
  6. Chickeninja

    BtZ Discussion: Duplication

    I am too lazy to dupe and because I don't feel like nagging other players, I play less. Simple as that. Maybe I'd play more if there were a single player way to collect useful items in multiplayer, like potions for example. The Pvp experience conflicts with survivor narrative in single player, as people going online for competitive multiplayer usually don't want to patiently collect items in single player to participate. This has been brought up too many times and nest spawns now dropping items goes in the right direction but if the whole item scavenging mechanism is forced upon survivors, then shouldn't the hunter have to farm for his spits and shields? Why does the hunter get free lunch? Can't he shop much faster due to tendrils and ghost claw? Can the hunter even go on supply runs? The answer: he can, because every time he tendrils into the store, the scavenging survivors yell: "Omg, a Night Hunter from Techland who should be feared!!!", and a noob asks: "But why?" The veterans laugh and yell in unison: "Cuz the next patch is coming, noob!" Your island sounds like a different game and the posts of late in this forum are unclear as to who has the authority to decide rules, limits, setups, where the lines are drawn for cheating, how they'll be monitored and enforced, who makes those decisions, and what histories they have with the game and/or the community. Therefore I can't comment or even decide whether I'd want to participate as it seems like everybody offers the ultimate in esports these days, without backing up the hype with enough facts. Another example here is: Without other fundamental things like permission to use Techland assets and/or engine for profit or community being cleared up... it's hard to be swayed either way. Wish you the best of luck though and keep us posted as to your progress. How much development time/resources do you think you need, given we assume naively that you have a green light to proceed, and what are contingency plans if the game is found to be broken etc?
  7. Chickeninja

    BtZ Feedback Wanted: 03/21/2018

    Why are the fonts automatically greyed out on my end btw? The community is diverse as can be seen by the difference in feedback from experienced players all the way to the feedback of people who have just played a few hours. Experienced players tend to forget that management of a game for the broad variety of users and their different levels of experience forces compromise between their voices and concerns with those of other players; however inexperienced or uninformed they may be. If the community were more cohesive and homogeneous the need for ugly compromises would diminish. It either is or is not an exploit, by which I mean the community and devs have to come to some understanding (or disagreement) of whether the exploit is a valid form of emergent game play or not. If people find such a mechanism to be consistent with the gaming experience, they have come to appreciate from the game, and there is broad consensus that its use is managed responsibly without abuse, then the mechanism should be accepted as a valid, standard, and thus legal move within the game mode. If not, then advocates find themselves supporting a feature that is often overpowered and abused, especially in the hands of folks that don't care what community and/or devs think concerning the issue. And I remember feeling "wow what a bummer for hunter movement" and being part of the critical voices. As for quickening response when something is off: if the community spoke and interacted among itself with more consensus, then it'd be able to escalate things quicker. If the clueless types you mentioned above are not clued in, then their complaints become justifiable: how would they know? And how would the developer not be forced into a difficult and hopeless compromise? TL:DR With bit more calm, will towards cooperation, and understanding whoever we deem to be clueless, we can remove at least some toxicity, need for secrecy, useless compromise or other measures that make the game mode less enjoyable. Give folks access to the mechanisms and histories that affect their gaming experience and ultimately let them be the judge. Clueless people can learn. Experts can become so busy defending their expertise that they forget the big picture or to have fun etc. Both sides need each other and with a bit more vigilance on staying cool with folks, things like sub-optimal patches can be addressed more effectively and with better response times. That is, if we approach things with a cooler head + without always having to call folks names or accuse them etc.
  8. Chickeninja

    BtZ Feedback Wanted: 03/21/2018

    That makes my point: such information is not accessible to everybody. And why should anybody have to "actively talk to" who you or I consider to be "good players", or even watch videos of such players? Tackling is a basic and essential mechanism of the game mode. It's as if when somebody's starting a board - or video game, they have to first enter into relationships with some allegedly good players, to figure out how to move pieces or roll dice. A game that fails to clarify its own basic rules and mechanisms speaks for itself. That said, I do know of information that was volunteered here in the past, where Techland seemed less than graceful in implementing what seemed to be valid points the community made and indeed, they mostly proceeded with a bulldozer's sensitivity. I'd just watch myself before blaming anybody. Devs have higher ups too and who knows what their agendas or budgets are? E.g. What if devs are not given sufficient resources or time to optimize the game mode in favor of some other Techland projects, and the community gets its panties in a twist because patching the game mode at this point is low priority or some similar scenario? That sort of statement doesn't clarify Techland's stance on the status of exploits. Particularly the part about where the community has to shut its mouth for fear of bad updates and the wrong nerfs and buffs. That's damaging for players, their experience, as well as studios and their developers. In the long run, everybody loses. This dynamic has to be reversed in favor of more transparent and sensitive approaches. Blaming each other and keeping secrets just fans the flames and leads to worse patches, as everybody's seen by now.
  9. Chickeninja

    BtZ Feedback Wanted: 03/21/2018

    This is a kind of point however, that illustrates an issue with BtZ mode: on the one hand, you can argue "that's just part of the game now and therefore necessary", but this is a liberal argument that assumes everybody has access to perfect information and will use that information responsibly "within the spirit of the game". But a large number of hunters I'd say, have no access to the ability or the information necessary to perform it, for a variety of reasons, not least of which is the tedious skill tree restriction, which is fine as a training method, when somebody opts for that; but if folks want more matches, then the hunter skill tree may lead to folks quitting their zombie careers and therefore decreasing total match numbers, as they might not want to put in 50 or so hours to deserve the right to feel what a fully specced hunter feels like in the first place, besides the unfortunate beginning hunters that want to rank up and that too often only have the bro brigades of highly experienced survivors to contend with, with little to no abilities at the start of their skill tree... essentially this encourages cheating and using others' saves etc. for hunters. There are a few ways to instant tackle, and yet I rarely see the responsible "within the spirit of the game use" you appear to assume. More community effort and coordination is required, and if the exploit is legit, as you seem to assume, then their mechanics should be featured in more hints than "cars lessen impact of falls" and be part of updating said hints. Same of course for survivor exploits but one veers into the costs of such arguments: if the game mode requires dozens of exploits to be legitimized as emergent gameplay, then the occurrences of overpowered combos and moves in various situations multiply... which require more buffs and nerfs, which in turn require more exploits to balance them out and on and on. The attitude of folks keeping exploits to themselves and not finding responsible ways of sharing them for the community to survive and enjoy themselves as a whole, with higher numbers of quality matches for everybody, is however clearly against the spirit of the game mode in this state. That is unless you want to be forever overpowered. I have no interest in such and often play public with weak survivors or whoever seems to be around, and observe far too many high level hunters AND survivors hiding exploits from each other for transparent attempts at maintaining advantages for themselves and their local groups. Whether the game mode, perhaps in future incarnations or patches, clarifies itself by reducing the number of exploits, with serious optimization OR whether it embraces these exploits as a fun thing that defines the game: I don't lean either way. That the community not disintegrate and that folks can enjoy that fact and their games more, seems more relevant. What appears to not be a "bad exploit" also depends on experience btw. What may appear balanced and valid to somebody with a thousand hours may not be so for folks who cannot access how to perform certain moves, combos etc. in certain situations. Informational advantage implies the game is imbalanced before the match begins, and with so many exploits and cheating opportunities, if we value genuine game play or have competitive aspirations, then this works against the game mode's survival, as nobody enjoys games being at an informational disadvantage to promote the ego trips of a few confused folks. This forum, despite the spam, has countered this tendency despite the many disagreements with folks sharing exploits, cheats they experience others using etc. Fun games to everybody volunteering their time and information here and thanks to everybody posting and pointing towards how we believe the game mode to be optimized (keep it up!), along with the devs of course, who face far more pressures/difficulties in their professional lives than the constant whining and complaining of hunters and survivors around these parts.
  10. Chickeninja

    We are back on the 1/12 Update, temporarily.

    Felt it IMMEDIATELY in game just a few minutes ago. Zaid flares leaving survivors hanging, survivors with much fewer drop attacks, and the amount of hunter spits/regen. I accused folks of playing 1/12 on purpose. Guess I'm the idiot then. And without people knowing what's happening, they have and will continue to blame the game, which is unfortunate.
  11. Chickeninja

    BtZ Feedback Wanted: 03/21/2018

    Still not much desire for 3v1s or 4v1s from both sides on PC, given Nightmare difficulty survivor settings. Feels like Hunter charity and although I enjoy making hunters feel good about their skills by playing survivor pinata, it's starting to feel like "bad work - hunter therapy" instead of "good game". Hope things get optimized and wish folks fun out there nonetheless. Unfortunately for fans of the game mode, the record is starting to indicate that such optimization is rare. So people wouldn't be too wrong to dial back expectations because "yes, there are updates and fixes due to community feedback", but also "yes, response time is very slow"- that is if problems get addressed in the first place, which isn't a given.
  12. Chickeninja

    Be The Zombie Balancing Update - 12/1/2018

    Usually devs play other games more than they play their own. The reason for this is that they have to "learn so much" from other games to be able to balance their own. That's why balancing is so hard, right? Perhaps we should follow their lead and grow our brains. As hunter, a recurring thing I see is survivors with infinite UV, which I feel is related to the changes of late. Folks balancing things on their own but just a couple of hours and my hunter is developing a tan. And as survivor one thing bugs me almost as much as the ugliness of seeing hunters with next to no experience, give folks that have invested time into the game mode a difficult time, IS the fact that from 1st person pov of survivor, everybody finds ways to deal with the enlarged radius and decreased duration of them popping... only to feel like "that spit landed on a surface two corners/objects behind me and game physics creates a false positive". So in this case, adapting doesn't do much to create a more satisfying experience. Physics is off and feels less like the direct live action realism I appreciated in this game mode. The longer all these fixes don't take place and the more people engage in group negativity, without groups being more proactive in promoting clean play instead of calling names, the less desirable the game mode will appear to the public. But since numbers seem up, it would seem that not fixing bugs makes a better game.
  13. Chickeninja

    Be The Zombie Balancing Update - 12/1/2018

    Gaming improving decision making and problem solving? That seems to only hold in the narrow sense of the game itself because it doesn’t appear to be as true as the gaming public would like to believe, i.e. you won’t learn how to smoothen social moves, drive better, perform surgery better, or make better decisions generally in the world by say becoming an experienced tactics specialist of Be the Zombie. I don’t see the evidence but since I don’t read everything, perhaps EM could enlighten us and point towards the science that establishes that. Nerves of steel? Lol, with all these benefits from better decision making, to better problem solving, AND growing uber balls it sounds like we could substitute military training and education with playing Be the Zombie. It’s cheaper and we get the same or better results. The problem with specialist arguments: just play a few more hundred or thousand hours and you’ll see what we mean. And that’s perfectly legitimate as far as opinions go, but falls flat when considering everyday facts: doing anything for a few hundred hours will make a person feel like they’re learning something, overcoming something, or conquering fear “practicing steel nerves”, training reflexes etc. But whether this is true for people's lives and in which sense they truly benefit? That seems much more unclear: how can you distinguish a time wasting activity from a bad game that keeps requiring you to spend more and more hours to "get it"? You could say the same about any other game or activity, even unpleasant ones that aren't fun. What makes a quality game world class and distinguishes it imho, is that you don’t have to earn a degree and spend hundreds of hours to learn what normal play is like and people still feel empowered in their choices and excited to play. Good game implies that genuine fun can be had easily. Hundreds of hours means that this is a specialist’s game mode and that balance decisions are made to benefit the highest level of play, while the rest have to bite a learning curve harsher than the early players, that tell everybody to grow some, when that's always easy for us to say because we were around the longest. And in the case of Starcraft etc. this is fine but Techland’s position remains clear regarding the question: Is the game mode only for PvP specialists (that have the freedom to play for hours daily) or is it for the general public to enjoy casually? And the balancing updates have swung BOTH ways, which nourishes false expectations that try to please everybody with neither specialists or beginners satisfied. Techland has repeatedly stated that they want to cater both to veterans’ as well as to casual expectations. But who knows what route they'll take in the end?
  14. Chickeninja

    Be The Zombie Balancing Update - 12/1/2018

    It may feel OT but it's not: There has been a general trend towards one specific kind of competitive play in PvP of the game which boxing Crane points towards: tactical play. This has eclipsed the strategic dimension almost entirely. I used to look forward to discovering how people approach PvP of the game. There were more styles which is why boxing Crane reminds me of this: nowadays almost all strategy is reduced to preparing for tactical confrontation, with chosen routes, best inventory choices, and play styles obeying this rule. Any deviation and losing is more likely. And because "balancing" has focused much on cleaning up the tactical areas, everybody plays much more similar because tactics on their own are pure mechanism... once one has overcome the feeling of pride of being tricky and smart for commanding some combination with the right timing, it loses the "aha freshness gotcha" quality it used to have and can become boring, implying infinite repetition of the same routines. There's more imagination in boxing Crane's possibilities than a thousand games played for the same tactical tricks over and over. Even a million hours of experience won't make a difference because: same mechanisms.
  15. Chickeninja

    Be The Zombie Balancing Update - 12/1/2018

    By this reasoning, nobody can have an opinion regarding a game unless they are highly experienced. That would create a lot of sadness in your life man, e.g. reading the internet or this forum. All these inexperienced idiots having opinions, right? Also, there is enough evidence of highly experienced experts committing tremendous stupidities that beginners aren't even be able to conceive, precisely because their attachment to some current state-of-affairs keeps 'em from seeing the forest for the trees. See politics/dictatorships/idiots that are convinced that their experience somehow magically insulates them from being wrong for proof. Now I have this image of Crane as some awesome boxer, punching hunters and zombies with elaborate combos, which IS consistent with survivor narratives in a zombie apocalypse setting. Perhaps more so than pimping the hunter/survivor to preside over high amounts of ever increasing resources with tweaked versions of what end up to be the same abilities over and over... calling it the best balancing ever, every couple of weeks, while alienating both beginners and experienced player base... that can't or don't want to invest the increasing time/effort it takes to be able to participate in the game without being a drag on possible team mates, let alone enjoy the thing. Boxing Crane seems fresher than all that.