James Gallagher

Be The Zombie Balancing Update - 12/1/2018

140 posts in this topic

you dont think 18 spits in a 1v1 is a bit much? lol

I mean for me, someone who doesn't like to duplicate items will use what medkits I have, what flares are given to me but it seems after every death, the hunter is already prepped with a full set of spits including UV heal which then leads to an overused tactic of spit+pounce+uv heal over and over. No effort whatsoever. Other than that, I agree with everything else.

Edited by CartierC

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You made the hunter's job much easier, but why won't you at least fix this horrible horde bug? Now it is even worse than before, becouse of the increased spit range I have the horde chasing me much more often, so the chance of getting killed by teleboomer is also bigger. And they are everywhere - building tops, roofs, balconies etc. Yesterday I got blown while standing on the street lamp in Old Town. Its like 10m over the ground and yet the boomer appeared just next to me. This is insane. I play coop with a friend and now its normal to get 3-4 telekills druing 1 match. This makes a huge and unfair difference in a close game.

The other sad joke is that the hunter respawns faster than the horde ends.

 

Edited by 4lkor
autocorrect changed the wrong word + adding last sentence.

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Those who were crying humans were more better are those who were totally noobs and didn't know how to play. It was totally balanced for veteran's hunters and humans. There are few hunters which are almost impossible to defeat. After this update they are surely too much overpowered to face head on plus totally noob hunters are difficult to defeat which is quite unfair. and those humans saying hunters are under powered are surely those who always hide behind there partners and don't do 1v1s at all. It was a total fair game. Loved to play and enjoy this game but this update ruined it. 

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My opinion the DFA and UV Light blinking nerf was needed. I'm glad those where implemented. The UV light intensity, cooldown penalty, and the rate at which spits recharge in 2v1, 3v1, and 4v1 need to be returned back to the way it was before this patch. I also think the radius of the spit explosion needs to be minimized some, but not to where it was before patch. I've been playing this game since release and have well over 2k hour logged. I also own the largest FB group dedicated to DL with over 12k members. Alot of the members feel the same about the recent patch.

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I’ve played this game since day 1 and love it even today, but this so-called balancing update is way over the top and not good at all! For the Humans! I’m a decent player (as human) and now get wrecked almost every time I go against a Hunter. Before the recent change it was difficult enough to battle Hunters and now this makes it very one-sided! These changes have ruined my experience all together and if something isn’t done to make it fair again for the Human to complete, I personally will be finally giving up on this beloved game, like many others are now doing! Sorry, but these changes are so over the top it’s not even challenging for the Hunters!!! Even my friends who play Hunters think this is very unfair and a joke & kill us in record time! You can say I’m a whiner all you want but again, I speak the truth!!! Moreover, if you look at most players who play, even before these updates, hardly ever have Zombie Invasions ON! Why?

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Alright, I played a few more 3v1s and 4v1s with the Hunter, one or two with Survivor. Here's what I think.

It's too difficult for the Survivors, and most of that difficulty comes from one thing alone: the amount of spits. They are just too much to handle, it comes to the point where the Hunter can freely spit here and there without any sort of aiming, tactic or prep (a.k.a no skill involved), retreat for around 15 seconds if nothing hits, and then come back and repeat the same thing. That should not be possible, it's the polar opposite of the situation before the update - where the Hunter was completely out of any resources and had to play flawlessly to land a single kill, now he can just do whatever and he'll wipe out most teams. From one extreme to the other.

Solution is simple: reduce the amount of spits available in 3v1s and 4v1s so that they're still more than pre-update, but less than their current state. As for the other aspects of 3 and 4v1s: 

- Damage is fine

- UV light range (not intensity) could use an increase

- Spit explosion timing, radius and duration are fine and manageable

- Flare cooldown should be decreased to a reasonable number, to counteract the 25-second-long UV spit and increased difficulty in draining the Hunter's energy

- 1v1s are fine in all aspects

- 2v1s are fine in all aspects

So, to sum it up: spit amount in 3v1s and 4v1s need a tone down. UV light range needs an increase. Flare cooldown needs a decrease.

I think you guys at Digital Scapes are best at finding the middle ground in between your nerfs and buffs, when you want to. I hope this post will help you find it for the current update, which I still like very much. And yeah, balancing an asymmetrical PvP mode is not easy, but with some tuning of the Survivor's and Hunter's current strength, the game will be the closest it has ever been to balanced and fair for both sides.

I feel like I have to point this out again, however. Whatever you do, please do not bring the game back to its past state - lifeless, no Hunters in hours of waiting, only the generic Survivors waiting with their buddies on Slums, waiting to exploit any Hunter with animation abuse and get their free wins - the kinds of players I'm certain a lot of the people posting in this thread are. No constructive criticism whatsoever, just complaints on how they can't play anymore.

Edited by Vallon

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After playing many games even I'm starting to believe that this is a bit too much. Inexperienced/new Hunters get way too much leeway with the new spit mechanics which encourages spam, little effort, and little thought. Combine that with the Auto-Balance, which is still broken and unfair, makes it even more tedious to fight a Hunter.

Here is a scenario when fighting a new/inexperienced Hunter: Hunter engages; realizes he can't pounce easily; starts spitting and misses ALOT; runs away to recharge; then proceeds to either wait for spits or attack in utter failure; after the human kills the first or second nest auto-balance kicks in and gives Hunter too much forgiveness as he can now spam spits to his hearts content with, again little effort and little thought; which leads to a very tedious and frustrating stalling match where all he needs to do is spit and run for the next 10-15 minutes in a match. All the while he gets to run away freely with no consequence, and even if you do kill him if the Survivor has a spit on him it will last on him when the Hunter respawns and engages the Survivor again because Auto-Balance is allows him to respawn insanely fast and continue to stall, and the spits effects last way to long.

Against an Experienced player however, its a whole different story. Animation abuse to lock players in place with either the UV Shield-Pounce trick or using Tackle making it 100% guaranteed for the spit to land unless his aim is bad, or mis-predicts. The fact narrow places or areas that offer little room to maneuver favor these new spits makes it more difficult as all the Hunter has to do is wait for the right time to engage, or literally use Tendril Sprint to dash around rooftops and fake his engages in order to drain the UV Light. UV Heal also makes it that if you are hit with a UV Spit you're 100% dead with no chance to even toss a flare. Killing him doesn't help either because once he respawns he's already loaded and has that second UV Shield and UV Spit ready if he manages to kill a Survivor. Also I don't know if its just me but I think the spits are recharging way too fast in 1v1 when the Hunter is winning, and that the UV Light seems to drain much faster when using it. Lastly there is some glitch or something involving Ground Pound where even after the auto-aim was patched some Hunters manage to still lock on perfectly. I don't know if its because of this Pre-Patch glitch I keep hearing or something else. One last thing to note is that when hit by a UV Spit and when its effect wears off, the UV Light has a chance to make Survivors start with very little battery which is rather unfair.

Now another problem that rises is the fact that before this patch spits were very easy to dodge. Literally anyone can dodge them unless some of the broken techniques from above were used, the Hunter lands a Tackle, has god-like aim, or manages to get a spit to hit in very specific situations. I personally don't know a solution, but it is something to note.

If there is one thing I can say its that please REMOVE THE AUTO-BALANCE. Seriously Survivors get a penalty for winning while Hunters get a buff for losing. That is seriously broken and is a horrible incentive. Survivor Scenario: He gets to a nest at the start and it has two broods. Kills them, and then proceeds to have to do longer stuff which somewhat stalls the game, but helps he Hunter. The second a Survivor is winning his next nest will have 3 broods, one or two goons and more zombies to deal with in order to avoid getting grabbed, taking damage, or stunned. This is all on top of a player controlled Hunter. The goons are by far the worst of them because even if you kill them or are about to they suddenly respawn and thus its more work for the Survivor, and its just time waster for Hunter to respawn quicker.

In summery, after playing many matches (mostly 1v1) it does feel rather unfair because of how little effort is made to land spits with the use of broken tactics, and leads to Survivors dying easily. The UV Light flickering can be something real big as Hunters can fake their engages to waste battery, and have to save battery the hunter is not within line of sight.

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I think that we need a medium between what used to be the grab distance for DFA and what you have made it now. The only other complaint I had was fixed already on the sense ability.  Thanks tech. Love the game

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Rain nerf - Remain
Spit radius - Remove (to original parameters)
Pop time on spits - Remain
Auto-Balance removal - Remain
2v1 Hunter life buff - Remain
Cool down on spits/UV shield - Revert to old timings
UV light distance reduction - Remain
UV light initial cost penalty - Remove

Please give me my favorite game back </3

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To keep my in-depth response short, I agree entirely with Vallon.

1v1 and 2v1 are just about right, the intensity of the match is there, casual players can enjoy it and try-hards will need max effort from every angle,

however 3v1 and 4v1 is a different story, I find it difficult the win a match with even the most basic hunters with less than 100 hours, mainly due to the amount of spits.

My only suggestion for 3v1 and 4v1 is to either reduce the amount of spits or give survivors 2 flares each.

Standing helplessly in the safety of my UV flare while my teammates get obliterated and thereafter, the hunter gazes into my adrenaline filled eyes waiting to feast on my flesh as it cooks in the midst of the UV flare knowing his purple saliva is only going to outlast my only safe haven and even if I wanted to throw another flare, he more than likely has another spit waiting but is smart enough not to waste it on a dead man.

Here is a screenshot of a bolter that defeated us once, came back and the only way I found to defeat him was to attack during tackle animations and/or camo+camping and other cheap tactics. 

https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/918040233938529642/C1690951052F2E87258F2612B958D9B22A618C23/

A total of 76 spits, 49 being successful in 18 minutes. and Yes he beat us the first time.

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This is unfair. Hunters now are able to just spam away spits and hit thanks to the reduced time and there was nothing wrong with the raindeath height this very much is unfair and im a decent survivor new players will think playing as the human is a living hell.

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13 hours ago, DyingLight1885 said:

there was nothing wrong with the raindeath heigh.

Oh yeah, there was nothing wrong with jumping from a small van and instantly killing the most powerful zombie with one left mouse button click. There was nothing wrong grappling 2 meters and one-shotting while he was in an animation and completely helpless. There was nothing wrong waiting up above for that one overpowered move and forcing him to either back off from a fight below or die.

13 hours ago, DyingLight1885 said:

new players will think playing as the human is a living hell.

Funny, I didn't see you here before the update saying new players will think playing as the Hunter is living hell, which it was. That's why the game was completely dead in terms of getting invaded - nobody wanted to play Hunter.

Advocating for the side you play is understandable and all, but it'd be great if you could get the bigger picture.

Edited by Vallon

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Im talking about ps4 players i dont know how its like on pc but for ps4 you can barely dodge spits and noobs just spit and run and raining death there was nothing wrong with that again i play on the ps4. I know there are others that feel the same way. Playing as hunter i almost have 2 max level hunters it was fair before the update i just now started saying what i think cause i do think this is bullshìt.

Edited by DyingLight1885

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TBH as a Hunter i hate these buffs, I'm not the best Hunter as it is and if i get a win i want it to be due to skill not buffs. This " Be The Zombie Balancing Update " needs to be removed asap, The things that should have been done are getting rid of the exploits & shortening the spawn in time for both the Survivor & the Hunter as it takes way too long to respawn after being killed. Another thing u guys should think about is turning the Antenna map into a Team Death match map, 6 v 2 no nests just a score/time limit. If the buffs are not going to be removed then how about bringing back Super Crane to pvp's only or give the survivors permanent Night Hunter Booster while in a match & boost the effects of the weapon mods so they have more effect on the Hunter than they do now

Edited by Ronin-Smurf

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There were so many Hunters, Carnivores and Apex Predators tonight over and over.  This game is total trash now!  How the heck you going to give all those advantages to hunters?  They have so many insta kills with bombers, pounces, toxic spits, uv spit that turns into insta kills and what do humans have??  Oh right you took that away because DFA now has to be precise.  I did one rain death tonight after playing over 4 hours because a friend allowed me.  I couldn't get a single DFA when I would get maybe 5 or something in a night.  You took away one of the most funniest part of this game.  Why do hunters get to level up so easily and humans stay prey all the time? After I get UV spit on me and throw a flair down, it runs out but I still have uv spit on me and insta death.  NH have so many more weapons at their disposal with toxic spit, sensory disabling, horde, uv spits and very mobile.  Don't you think that's a bit much even for 4 players?  If NH are complaining when they first start out, it's because they aren't good at it.  I made it all the way to Carnivore and played against some tough players and also played lots of newbies. Please remove all the updates. There were four of us against apexs and with all these hunter updates it was bad every game and we're all mid-level skills.  Out of the 20 games I played, I only won 1.  Why do we lose a life when a person leaves?  Many times they leave cause it lags out or gets disconnected.  This game could be so much better but now it's not playable at all. I'm going to insta quit this game lol. 

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Yes i agree with elle this is the same thing that has happened to me most of the hunters use hordes to get easy kills and thanks to the tackling and spitting to get it stuck on survivors or groundpounding and spitting hunters have huge huge advantage. 

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Hello everybody this is my first message on the forum so about BTZ what i have to say ??? Hmm

Great and im talking in both ways as a survivor/hunter

I have been reading some posts in last few days and decided to make an acc and give my thoughts. 

It seems like there are a lot of people complaining about this and that and i think they dont give some time on actualy playing and trying to find the best solution for this and that hunter or human. 

I am legend 34 (maybe35) dont remember i started to play BTZ like 2,3 weeks ago and i have as much victorys when human or night hunter (got my 1st mutation yesterday) i dont have any problem with current settings in game i think the UV are good the way they are (you need to be careful how you use it dont blame something else if you put your self in akward situation with hunter) i think the same with hunter same akward situation what i mean by that well i play with what game give me and i try to read my monster or prey. 

Example : I meet one guy in some invadion and since we play together and we always try to read the hunter (what hes doing hes combos) we watch to be together but not in the same radius of 5m because of the hunter spits, sometime we take a little longer path to the nests because that one in the woods in front of us is not trusty (bad visibility, no hight ground in case of bombers etc) so as i said more victorys than defeats... pardon more aborted then defeats hehehe. 

For the night hunter same logic as they say devide to reign better, i played few hours ago against 4 survivors and basicly they were like 2 guys on lamps roof waiting for DFA i felt in that trap like maybe 2 times and at the end i won with last nest left it was a thought game (25-30m) it was a mental game i saw one a little bit separeted from the group i killed him i saw that one trying to run to the nest while the ithers 3 were fighting me i killed him and i came back, basicly the most important thing when you are NH is to never let the run freely.

So in my case its not this skill is better then that or the cooldown is slower or faster then that one blablabla its about how you use what you have and for me its working prety well for now. 

Good night and good luck

(ps sorry for some faults not my main language) 

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Really how am j going to drop a flare if I can't even make it to 1 hive before I die 6 times what am in going to drop a flare ever 1 min to the 20 times I been anti uv gooed gee that sure would help or between the tackle tackle tackle yup sure FU°CK You and FU-ck your  Chupacabra

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4 minutes ago, White-devil1015 said:

Really how am j going to drop a flare if I can't even make it to 1 hive before I die 6 times what am in going to drop a flare ever 1 min to the 20 times I been anti uv gooed gee that sure would help or between the tackle tackle tackle yup sure FU°CK You and FU-ck your  Chupacabra

How about you don't talk on the balancing threads anymore.

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Well if you are playing alone you need to progres slowly you need to make your way if he killed you 6 times it means you played bad 6 times the only way for him to make an easy kill is only if you let him do that, or if you are playing in team well your team sucks if you are not protecting each other

Ps: tackle>dodge

Edited by NikoTosic

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